CKC

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Let's Talk Axles

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rking.1688 Ryan K
Delaware, Ohio, USA   USA
I want some help figuring out the axles on these karts. I've got frame and wheels figured out, this is the next step. So here is what I'm thinking so far:

Front axle will be straight 1.5" OD tube. I will mount it either with a quarter elliptical or cantilever mounted semi elliptical spring mount. I know those are more complicated, but I really like the look. And honestly, I'd much rather do spring mounts than bending an axle in my home shop.

Rear axle...I have absolutely no ideas what-so-ever. I would like to use sealed pillow block bearings bolted to the frame, other than that I'm clueless. What diameter do the VKC wheels use? Do I need to plan the drive train before I can pick a rear axle?

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dBlast Avatar
dBlast Vince De Blasi
Maple, Ontario, Canada   CAN
If you haven't already read through this thread, it is full of information on parts sources. Watch Dennis Thomas' video in post# 48 and it will tell you just about every part needed and where to get it:

Part list thread

Vince.

dBlast Avatar
dBlast Vince De Blasi
Maple, Ontario, Canada   CAN
The Vintage Kart Co rear wheels are attached to a 1" keyed axle with their wheel hub sandwiched around the wheel. I would suggest their wheel hub (specifically designed for this cyclekart application as opposed the the ATV hub which required some modification that most people were using before). See the Dennis Thomas video at the 12:30 mark in the video named - "1930 BMW Roadster The final details part 2" for an explanation of the setup.

Vince.

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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
Woodysrods Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
VKC uses Peerless Difs from Northern Tool.
You can buy them on eBay for $119.00 (i bought two so far)
Dennis is using one in his latest build 37 Modified Studebaker.
Do your homework, before you start ordering things.
VKC has great spindles c/w bearing that fit there brand new wheels (different size then stock), Rear hubs that fit 1" solid axles (available thru HF or BMI or the Difs I mentioned.
Their springs are better than buggy seat springs, and they have more!..............Disc brake kits, sprockets,rotors, etc.
Good Roads
Brian
I spent 8 months purchasing and researching all the parts for for my build.
Got some great stuff.

rking.1688 Ryan K
Delaware, Ohio, USA   USA
I am for sure going to use VKC wheels, so what size axle do I need to look for? I don't want to go with a traditional build, so a differential type axle wouldn't be correct since it can transfer power in a slip situation, correct? If I go with a standard straight axle only one rear wheel would be keyed, right?

So far I'm thinking VKC wheels, springs and front spindles. But that's as far as I've gotten.

Pierro Taruffi Rhys Nolan
Tamworth, Staffs, UK   GBR
1923 CycleKart Vintage "Voisin Laboratoire"
Have a look at BMI, and check out their "Trailer Mover package" substitute the axle and do something about brakes.

You are asking questions, many of which are covered in the FAQ at the top of this forum, the rear axle debate has been endless, there are as many opinions as Heinz Beans smiling smiley

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Denny Graham Silver Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, Illinois, USA   USA
In spite of that....keep asking Ryan, many of us are new to the sport and have similar
questions but don't have days and weeks to spend searching thru dusty old archives
with search engines that most often lead to dead ends. And most of us don't mind
repeating an answer for someone who is new to the sport.
Brian's suggestion to watch Dennis Thomas's videos on youtube is the best way
to get up to speed and they will answer 99% of your questions.
Besides, it's always fun to watch someone else work.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

rking.1688 Ryan K
Delaware, Ohio, USA   USA
In reply to # 23104 by Denny Graham In spite of that....keep asking Ryan, many of us are new to the sport and have similar
questions but don't have days and weeks to spend searching thru dusty old archives
with search engines that most often lead to dead ends. And most of us don't mind
repeating an answer for someone who is new to the sport.
Brian's suggestion to watch Dennis Thomas's videos on youtube is the best way
to get up to speed and they will answer 99% of your questions.
Besides, it's always fun to watch someone else work.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Thanks again for the reference for the recommendation on the videos. I'll give them a look. I'm trying to figure out suspension right now, just can't decide what I should do!

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Woodysrods Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Well, I have just spent over a week (almost full time) building fake rear springs for my Miller project.
Wanted them to be strong, light, and original looking.
But much like the old saying "You can have Cheap, Good, or Fast, but not all Three"!
So, this has been an exercise in imagining the concept, engineering, designing, fabricating, assembling, welding, finishing........oh, did I mention getting carried away???
And did I also mention they are still not finished!!!!! There were over 40 fabricated pieces, requiring assembly in a specific order (to allow inside welds)
and getting heavier by the moment.
I will post pictures in my build thread of this crazy project.
Rear Suspension would have been way simpler and a lot less weight.
And weight is usually the contributing factor in the choice to suspend or not to suspend your rear axle.
There did not seem to be much difference at the finish lines in Tieton, between the suspended CKs and the Non Suspended ones.
And if you watch Dennis' videos of the Grand Prix race, you won't see much difference in handling either.
Once again, we are back to the simplicity and functionality of the "Stevenson Formula"
"If it ain't broke, why try to fix it?"
Good Roads
Brian

Pierro Taruffi Rhys Nolan
Tamworth, Staffs, UK   GBR
1923 CycleKart Vintage "Voisin Laboratoire"
Ryan, are you thinking about front, or rear suspension?
I firmly believe the front should be guided by your "inspiration" car. If you are talking about rear suspension, read what Brian has written above. I have driven many of these, as well as a good number of full size vintage cars, a cycle kart with no rear suspension handles pretty much like any of the "performance" vintage cars I have driven, and to be honest most of them had very limited rear suspension travel, and inch or two not being unusual. For me it's a "no brainer" KISS (Keep it simple sweetness) also fits my other rule "add lightness", no rear suspension, If you get uncomfortable a cushion will do the trick, and weighs almost nothing.

I also firmly believe (personal opinion) that if you don't have an inspiration and are "inventing" a car, it doesn't fit the ethos of what the whole thing is about, and becomes a "custom kart" and that's why the sub forum was introduced by Skye (our host) a few years back, to try to keep the cycle kart forum on track. If you want a custom kart do whatever you feel like, nobody should criticize.

Woodysrods Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Good Morning Rhys (evening to you)
I am still chasing the elusive "Star" or "Spider" washers for my "Friction Shocks".
Guess I will have to make my own?? Probably could have had them finished in the time I have wasted chasing around looking for them.
GoodRoads
Brian

Pierro Taruffi Rhys Nolan
Tamworth, Staffs, UK   GBR
1923 CycleKart Vintage "Voisin Laboratoire"
In reply to # 23112 by Woodysrods Good Morning Rhys (evening to you)
I am still chasing the elusive "Star" or "Spider" washers for my "Friction Shocks".
Guess I will have to make my own?? Probably could have had them finished in the time I have wasted chasing around looking for them.
GoodRoads
Brian

Hw many do you want? Do you want labels too? I have spares of both. They may take a wee while to extract from the storage locker but you are welcome to some as shown on the finished pic on the topic. Sorry for going OT Ryan.

Woodysrods Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Thanks Rhys
PM sent
Yes, sorry Ryan
brian

rking.1688 Ryan K
Delaware, Ohio, USA   USA
I would like to model it after a 1929 Frazer Nash chain gang. It doesn't have the exposed frame that the basic CK design has, but that might be worked around. It has quarter elliptical, so I'm thinking I might get some 500# trailer springs and chop them. A lot cheaper option than cutting up VKC springs.

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