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Plans for the Viscount Vinson Model T Special

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SteveV Avatar
SteveV Steve Vinson
Phoenix, Arizona, USA   USA
1924 Ford Model T "Viscount Vinson Special"
1927 CycleKart American "Mono Wasp"
Hi All,
Here are some drawings that I had made of my build. Use them as a guide for your own kart or copy it.....you have my blessing to do so.

This is a very basic "Stevenson Formula" frame, I added extra cross members for strength.

Just make sure you double check on the placement of the motor mount and the frame members under the mount don't interfere with your selection of brake rotors and sprockets. (Mine are a 6" brake and a 60T #35 sprocket) if you use a different size, just move fore or aft to accommodate as needed.

Also, not shown on the drawings, I added a brace running from the rear most cross member forward below the motor and the axle ending behind the seat, it ties the three cross members to together. I was having trouble with chassis flex under hard acceleration and the chain was making a popping noise, the brace eliminated that.

Cheers!



Steve Vinson
Arizona CycleKart Club

Design-Build-Race-Repeat

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VINSON-Layout1.pdf    13.1 KB

VINSON-Layout2.pdf    12.6 KB
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VINSON-Layout3.pdf    9.7 KB
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Viscount Vinson #7.jpg    58.7 KB
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Denny Graham Silver Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, Illinois, USA   USA
Steve, those are some "pretty" tight bends you show in the drawing
or should I say...pretty impossible to make bends, especially in
1 5/8".tubing. How do you suggest one would make an axle to
your specifications??

This is the tightest bend that is possible in a smaller, 1 1/2" tube
and it took a $300 4.5" radius die in a JD squared bender to make them.
Denny G


Attachments:
Front Axle Weld Fixture 06.JPG    53.8 KB
Front Axle Weld Fixture 06.JPG

SteveV Avatar
SteveV Steve Vinson
Phoenix, Arizona, USA   USA
1924 Ford Model T "Viscount Vinson Special"
1927 CycleKart American "Mono Wasp"
Denny,
That's the drawing Dennis Thomas shared with me from his Fronty Ford. I took that drawing to local race car fabricator and he made the bends, I don't know exactly how he did it.



Steve Vinson
Arizona CycleKart Club

Design-Build-Race-Repeat

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Denny Graham Silver Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, Illinois, USA   USA
Well thank you Steve. By the way....that's a mighty nice looking
and well proportioned kart ya got there.
The only way I know you could accomplish that bend, would be to cut,
weld and grind or weld in a billet corner splice. Anyone who knows of a
better way to put a 2" radius bend in a 1 5/8" x .095" wall tube I'd sure
like to hear about it.
Those simple ladder frames oughta be a snap to throw together.
If I would have settled for one of them along with a straight front axle,
store bought springs, spindles and gokart steering....I would have
been putting miles on my kart this summer. Instead...I'm spending
my summer making tooling to make the parts as though I were
planning on going into production on them. But....that's the only
way I know how to work! Been working on my propane heat treat/forge
for the better part of last and this month. Still gotta experiment with
the heat treat of my front springs. Of course that's not the only project
I've got in mind for a gas forge/oven.
dg

SteveV Avatar
SteveV Steve Vinson
Phoenix, Arizona, USA   USA
1924 Ford Model T "Viscount Vinson Special"
1927 CycleKart American "Mono Wasp"
Pretty sure the bend on my actual axle doesn't look exactly like the rendering. This is the drawing I gave to the guy to bend the tube and weld the spindle bracket. To my eye it looks good, it works great and is how I did it, just thought it may be helpful to others.

Making your own forge is so very cool.

Cheers



Steve Vinson
Arizona CycleKart Club

Design-Build-Race-Repeat

refisk Avatar
refisk Rick Fisk
Frankenmuth, Michigan, USA   USA
Take a photo from the front so we can see the axle better. smiling smiley

In reply to # 25218 by SteveV Pretty sure the bend on my actual axle doesn't look exactly like the rendering. This is the drawing I gave to the guy to bend the tube and weld the spindle bracket. To my eye it looks good, it works great and is how I did it, just thought it may be helpful to others.

Making your own forge is so very cool.

Cheers

LowellR Silver Member Lowell Roemke
Tempe, Arizona, USA   USA
A friend of my son that had the tube bender did this one for me a couple of years ago. I went 20" between the frame rails so it looks a bit wide compared to most. The weld beads on the top in the bend area are there to help keep the U-bolts from slipping.

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Uncle Fester Avatar
Uncle Fester Daniel Parris
Kent, Washington, USA   USA
Thanks Steve. These drawing will be very helpful for a starting point in designing our Kart. We are planning on a track T Fronty Ford type. I got an answer from Vintage Kart today on how to order wheels and other miscellaneous part from them. this gets us one step closer to getting the build underway. Now I just need to finish getting the shop organized we can practice our machining and welding skills. Can't wait.



Dan Parris (Uncle Fester)

CK on the drawing board.

SteveV Avatar
SteveV Steve Vinson
Phoenix, Arizona, USA   USA
1924 Ford Model T "Viscount Vinson Special"
1927 CycleKart American "Mono Wasp"
Here is a decent view. It is more of a curve than an elbow.



Steve Vinson
Arizona CycleKart Club

Design-Build-Race-Repeat

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20170509_135657.jpg

Denny Graham Silver Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, Illinois, USA   USA
Yep, that’s more the reality of tube bending for a large diameter tube Lowell. Probably
looking at a 5-7” radius bend

Watch out for that “getting the shop organized” bit Dan. I started that 5 ½ years ago, and
I’m still organizing. Problem is……I keep collecting more stuff to organize!!!!!
Vintage Kart is getting to be a viable enough factory that I’m surprised they haven’t
developed a decent web page to deal with the products that they are handling/producing.
Seems that would take a lot of the load off Jack Gee if they had a parts listing and on line
order form.

There you go Steve, that’s more like it. That drawing is more of a picture theory
of representation. I put a lot of effort into getting the tightest bend I could in the
1 ½ “ that I used. Even spent a week trying to make the 3” radius die I turned up
on the lathe work in my one shot bender but in the end I had to scrap that and settle
on the 4.5” radius JD Squared bends.
I’ve seen a few guys use schedule 10 pipe weld fittings for the bend. You can get very
tight elbows in those fittings. I was a Sr. welding tech for many years at Fermi National
Accelerator in Illinois and 90% of my work was tig welding SS pipe, but I personally am not
a fan of welding an elbow in at that point. I much prefer a single homogeneous tube for the
front axle.
Many of the Riley Brooklands (which is my inspiration car) had a front axle that was a very
distinctive feature. They used a forged I-beam front axle that was drilled. The forging
transitioned to a tapered round shape right before the rather tight bend at the kick up.
Since that axle is so distinctive, my original plan was to use a drilled 1 ½” I-beam for
the center section and weld in the tubing bend, which I would have split and tapered
up to the king pin boss.
But…..that got more and more complicated once I thought it out and like I
said, I couldn’t make the bend tight enough and all the welding for those
splice joints just didn’t feel right to me. And….there is no way would I try to forge
an axle in my meager shop. My new forge/oven, isn’t primarily made to actually
“forge” iron. I’m making it mostly for heat treating and the driving force right now is
heat treating the 5160 leaf springs that I’ve made.

DG


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Propane forge-kiln-oven 04.JPG

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