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My 1935 Miller-Ford V8 build is started

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1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Bruce, look at post #168 of this thread. There's a video.

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Woodysrods Avatar
Woodysrods Silver Member Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
???????? Christmas!

Racie35 Avatar
Racie35 Bruce T
Terre Haute, IN, USA   USA
In reply to # 36157 by 1908Rick Bruce, look at post #168 of this thread. There's a video.

That's surprising it gives enough..they're designed to not twist...right?

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1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Bruce, I think they're designed to twist some when torqued, but then return to normal, like a spring.

Brian, if you send me some 3/4 aluminum, enough to do four spinners, I'll take them to the water jet place, then turn them for you. The problem is attaching them to your wheels. How do to plan to do that?

Woodysrods Avatar
Woodysrods Silver Member Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
In reply to a post by 1908Rick,
Brian, if you send me some 3/4 aluminum, enough to do four spinners, I'll take them to the water jet place, then turn them for you. The problem is attaching them to your wheels. How do to plan to do that?
[/quote
At one point I had a plan for attachment........but like most thing these days, I have forgotten it.
Guess I will have to check my notes, and hope I made some.
I have the same wheels, hubs, and front spindles as you have, but I was just razzing you.smileys with beer
We are too far apart to be sending raw materials across the country........and I can have them water jet cut right hear in Westbank.
Plus I have two lathes out in the shop.
Got back out there today, reacquainting myself with the Miller, and figuring out the tail remodel and engine cover latch.
I Think I came up with a plan!
Going to compare it to you video!smiling bouncing smiley
Thanks
Brian

1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Way back when I started this project, I made it known that I intended to try a completely different sort of front suspension for cyclekarts, and use torsion bars.
My plan was to use 3/8 drive ratchet extensions for the bars. Charles Shultz chimed in with his support and formulas to calculate the wheel rate for a given diameter and length of bar.
So I built the car using Kobalt Tools 10" ratchet extensions.
It worked great, but the more I drove the kart, especially on the grass, the more I thought the suspension might be a little too stiff.
Rather than struggle with the formulas again, I went online and quickly found a wheel-rate calculator for torsion bars.
You simply plug in your numbers and it tells you your wheel rate. I put in the numbers for the Kobalt Tools extensions and found it was 124.7#. Way too much.
So off to Lowes I went, and I picked up a couple more extensions, this time Craftsmen Tools. They measured .470 diameter over approximately 8.75" between the ends. I turned about 7.5 inches of that length down to .390, and tapered the bar up to the ends. So the actual working length went from 8.75 to 7.5.
I plugged these new numbers in to the calculator and got 69#. That's more like it. The front end is much more compliant over bumps now, and if pushed hard in a corner, is less likely to understeer.
The best part is, these bars literally take two minutes to swap out, so I could turn up a few different diameter bars to dial in the suspension to the track, or use a stiffer bar on the right side for an oval track.

https://swayaway.com/tech-room/torsion-bar-wheel-rate-calculator/



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-12-30 09:23 PM by 1908Rick.


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5 Front suspension.jpg    34.1 KB
5 Front suspension.jpg

Woodysrods Avatar
Woodysrods Silver Member Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Makes great sense!
Just like the different coloured extensions used in Tire Shops for torquing on wheels!
Brian

1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Turns out the Miller is more of a pig than I was hoping it would be. I knew I should have used lightweight thread on the seat upholstery.
Using one bathroom scale and three wood blocks just never worked because I wasn't able to get the same readings twice in a row, and as it turns out, the total weight I was getting was about 12-15 pounds less than these readings.
So I bought another identical bathroom scale and used two wood blocks.

The first weigh-in: right front 42#
left front 30#
right rear 71#
left rear 89#

That's a lot of diagonal. Might be good for a tight oval, but not so much for turning both directions. Luckily, I built the front torsion bars to be adjustable. Just a few turns of the jacking screws and I had this.

Second weigh-in: right front 36#
left front 36#
right rear 80#
left rear 80#

So a total weight of 232# with an almost full fuel tank. Not too bad, I guess.
If I go on a starvation diet, I could get the race weight down to 400#. cool smiley

Woodysrods Avatar
Woodysrods Silver Member Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Way to go Rickthumbs upthumbs up
Those are my exact "Target #s as well!
Although my Miller has been neglected tis past month, I have been working on the
"Race Weight"...."Driver" went on the Tieton Diet starting Jan 2/19.
Starting weight 222 lbs.
10 days in 208 lbs..............14 lbs down!
The first 15 lbs is always the easiest!..........But, do you know how many holes in the
chassis I would have to drill for 14 lbs?eye rolling smiley
Can't wait to see your Miller this summer!
Brian



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-01-12 03:57 PM by Woodysrods.

Denny Graham Gold Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, IL, USA   USA
1950 Chevrolet 3600 "Old Blue"
1954 Chevrolet 3600
222 lbs......is that the weight of the Miller Brian???? And by drilling more holes, are you
hoping to get it down to 208????

Well Rick, 238 lbs is nothing to scoff at. It's pretty hard to get much lower than that and
still have any durability built into one. Especially when the body work and accoutrements
finish it off so nice.
dg

1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Maybe I could get Mark Martin to drive it for me. I think he's about 140# soaking wet. smileys with beer Would that be cheating? Come to think of it, I don't think he could reach the pedals. Never mind. spinning smiley sticking its tongue out

Denny, I think Brian means the driver was 222# and is now 208#. I hope he not drilling himself full of holes.confused smiley

I'm also back on the "diet". I'm at 215 now, going to 195 by June. Less smileys with beer, more lettuce.sad smiley

CmdBentaxle Avatar
CmdBentaxle Dave D
Federal Way, WA, USA   USA
1950 CycleKart Italian "1950 Ferrari 166 F2"
230 lbs is no pig Rick. You would still be among the lightest cars at Tieton.
Denny's right about the light vs durable compromise. The Gittreville guys found early on that there can be a
high price to pay for an ulralight over the rough courses. And I'm not just talking about that orchard.
Just the back straight of the G.P. in town can embarrass too dainty a chassis.
At the other extreme, there have been several enrties over the years that weighed north of 350lbs!

1908Rick Avatar
1908Rick Rick Eggers
Cape Coral, FL, USA   USA
Wow. 350#? There's a point where things will break from being over stressed by their own weight, not necessarily from rough surfaces. I guess 232 is pretty good then. thumbs up

Woodysrods Avatar
Woodysrods Silver Member Brian Woods
Westbank B.C., Canada   CAN
Yes, repurposing crow bars for spring hangers, can get one north of 300# in a hurry.
Brian
PS
Beer consumption is at an all time low this month!smileys with beer
But, if it is hot at Tieton we might have to tip a few!smileys with beer That is if we make our weight goals by then?eye rolling smiley
Never hot there! Right Dave?

Denny Graham Gold Member Dennis Graham
Sandwich, IL, USA   USA
1950 Chevrolet 3600 "Old Blue"
1954 Chevrolet 3600
Yeah,yeah......I know what he meant Rick, just pullin' the old boys leg.
Yep, 232 lbs is damn good. I'm sure I'm going to 300 and who know's,
maybe a tad over. Especially if I decide to put that big block in it
if the 212 disappoints me. But that don't worry me none, me with dang
near the same weight I was in high school, i.e. 155 lb. I fluctuate between
that and 165 depending on what time of year it is and how many cookies
I take on. My daughter would have to go and find a guy that loves to bake!!!!
Denny G
Sandwich, IL



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-01-12 07:23 PM by Denny Graham.

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