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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
Four wheels arrived today. Now how do I adapt them for Kart use?



S'all for now!

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DavidMGA1600 Avatar
DavidMGA1600 David Lake
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia   AUS
1960 MG MGA "Dads Car"
1961 CycleKart Race Car "Team Ferrari"
Victor,

What wheels have you bought?.
Are they the Honda CT90-110 wheels?



David

1960 MGA 1600 Convertible,
Gold Coast, Australia.

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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
Yes, they are for a CT110. Do the fronts get a plate on the outside of the wheel? All the spindles I've looked at are 5/8, can I get bearings for those spindles that will fit in the Honda wheel or do I have to bore out the wheel?



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Dennis Thomas Avatar
phoenix, AZ, USA   USA
1919 CycleKart Lightweight "A.V. Monocar"
1925 CycleKart Speedway Racer "Old Number 27"
1930 CycleKart German "The Boulevard Cruiser"
1937 CycleKart American "37 Studebaker Modified"
Hi Victor,
I have attached a four photos to help you move forward on your hubs. Two are of the front hubs and two are of the rear hubs. The front hubs use 3/4" spindles (on mine) with bearings. The inside of the honda hub (bore) is 37mm. This means that the bearing needs to be 37mm o.d. and have a 3/4" i.d or in your case 5/8" i.d. You may have a problem finding a bearing with these specs. I have not found a source as of yet and so the bearings I have are 37mm o.d. and 20mm i.d. then I use thin simm stock around the axle to take up the slop. This is not ideal but will work for test driving. My buddy Brian turned a piece of oilite bearing stock on the lathe into a real slick bearing that fits the 37mm hole and has a 5/8" inner bore. I will take a photo and post it tomorrow. I think this would be the way to go on these front hubs. Maybe you can find an off the shelf bearing with these specs if you look long enough. I have to make a set of oilite bearings for my spindles so I could make you a set at the same time if need be.
The other two photos show my rear hubs. They don't show alot of detail but you can go on You Tube (search cyclekart progress) and look at Steve Cameron's (smcameron) videos. He has a whole string of videos and there is one that details how he put his hubs together.

Good luck with your build

Dennis



Link to Cyclekart videos http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCh0MOBj4QLAYsl4XsfXHfWA/videos?flow=grid&sort=da&view=0

Link to Old #27 build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/Old%2027%20Build%20photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to Monocar build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/1919%20AV%20Monocar%20Build%20Photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to BMW Roadster build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/1930%20BMW%203-15%20PS%20Wartburg%20Roadster%20build%20photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to my Facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/dennis.thomas.7564


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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
Thanks for the pictures Dennis, they are a great help. Are you using 4 rear wheels? I have 2 fronts and 2 rears. I'm going to use the fronts as rears and the rears as fronts. Seeing the fronts already have bolt holes in them, that only makes sense to me. I will diffenently take you up on the bearing material, just email and I'll tell you where to send them and tell me what you want for them. My email addy is in my profile.



S'all for now!

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Dennis Thomas Avatar
phoenix, AZ, USA   USA
1919 CycleKart Lightweight "A.V. Monocar"
1925 CycleKart Speedway Racer "Old Number 27"
1930 CycleKart German "The Boulevard Cruiser"
1937 CycleKart American "37 Studebaker Modified"
Hi Victor, Typically all of the rims that we use are front rims but I don't see why you couldn't use rear rims. Some rear rims have extra castings that would make them hard to modify but not all of them. I have seen others use rear rims so I know you would be OK as long as you can get your new hubs to mount up to the rim. I also attach 3 photos of the oilite bearing that we are experimenting with. We make the bearings from oilite bar stock turned to size on the lathe. I say we are experimenting because there is no roller bearing in the hub. The axle rides on the oilite stock (with a little grease) so we are not sure if they will wear out after a few hours of running or will last a long time. Time will tell. The axle fits the oilite bearing perfectly with no slop so I like that.

Dennis



Link to Cyclekart videos http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCh0MOBj4QLAYsl4XsfXHfWA/videos?flow=grid&sort=da&view=0

Link to Old #27 build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/Old%2027%20Build%20photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to Monocar build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/1919%20AV%20Monocar%20Build%20Photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to BMW Roadster build photos
http://s1072.photobucket.com/user/DThomas1925/library/1930%20BMW%203-15%20PS%20Wartburg%20Roadster%20build%20photos?sort=3&page=1

Link to my Facebook page
https://www.facebook.com/dennis.thomas.7564


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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
I was thinking of something else. Are they a metal compound?



S'all for now!

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smcameron Stephen Cameron
Santa Clara, CA, USA   USA
I used 4 front wheels from Honda CT-90.

Your wheels, if they are like mine were, probably came with bearings -- 37mm outer diameter, 12mm inner diameter. These bearings need to come out because the 12mm inner diameter is useless, far too small for wheels that are on an axle supported only from one side. For that, you need a tool -- a slide hammer blind hole bearing puller. http://www.harborfreight.com/blind-hole-bearing-puller-95987.html You can potentially get by with a screwdriver and a hammer instead, but your life will be much happier and simpler if you just buy (or borrow) the right tool.

(BTW, Michael Droll has an interesting front wheel bearing solution using thrust bearings, which actually seems like the "right" way to go compared to what is usually done on cyclekarts. Perhaps he can provide some details on that.)

For the cyclekart front wheels, I used Dayton 6904zz bearings from vxb.com that are 37mm outer diameter, 20mm inner diameter. The 37mm outer is perfect, so you just press them into the wheels, no modification to the front wheels necessary. 20mm is just a tad bigger then 3/4th inch diameter of the Azusa front spindle axles. I shimmed with aluminum flashing material (I bought stainless steel shim material, but was unable to form it satisfactorily). See: http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/6904ZZ-1

For the rear cyclekart wheels, again used front ct-90 wheels, but with some modifications. Had to hack off a good portion of the inside of the central bearing holder to accomodate the nut which holds the ATV hub onto the rear axle. And had to grind down the outside of the welded bolts on the ATV hub to fit inside the honda wheels. And drill 4 holes in the wheel hubs and the ATV hubs so they can be bolted together.

Video here may help explain what is done on the rear wheels:



Pressing bearings into front wheels:
(about 2:30 mark)



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 2012-11-13 10:37 PM by smcameron.

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carChips Avatar
carChips Victor Harnish
Kelowna, BC, Canada   CAN
1933 MG Magnette
1973 Triumph Spitfire 1500 "Chip"
1989 GMC Sierra 1500 "Bush Truck"
Thanks for the info Stephen. The link for the bearings is very useful. Seeing I have 2 rear wheels I'll use them for the back and sandwich the wheel between a plate and the hub. This will give a nice flat surface to bolt to on the outside of the wheel. Same amount of machining as you, with the exception of the outside plate. I'll post some pics when I get at it. I still have a Spitfire that needs a top put on it, but with winter fast approaching there will be ample time to get lots done on both.



S'all for now!

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SevenTurbanBourban Avatar
SevenTurbanBourban Christobal Welchissimo
Auburn Hills, MI, USA   USA
1934 CycleKart Custom "Type-69"
1938 CycleKart Race Car "Rotten Tuna"
We have been using 5/8 axles. I dont know why ppl use the 3/4 axles but so be it. The actual ID of the 'hole' left when the CT90 press-fit bearings are removed is <<<<<< 32mm >>>>> not 37. Which roughly translates to 1 3/8". The ID of the 5/8" axle is exactly 15.9mm or 5/8". If ppl are suggesting a 37mm ID on the 'hole' i assume they are talking about the Honda SL100 Hubs, and not the CT90 hubs.

In any case, the bearings we are using are called "1623-2RS", which have a 5/8 ID exactly, and they are CHEEP at both MFG supply and VXB. The do involve some 'shimming' but the result will be satisfactory.

The true problem with the CT90 wheels which nobody states on ANY forum or blog is that the 1" live axle hub adapters for the rear wheels creates all sorts of problems. NOBODY makes a 130mm keyed hub-plate-adapter to close the gaping hole on the rear CT90 hubs. Much less the SL100 hubs. In essence, the nature of this beast is compromise, I think at the end I will machine my own hubs and lace them to fit exactly rather than retrofit bargain parts. But thats just me....for now I settle for the CT90 rear wheels and alot of adapter 'plates' and shims to make it work.

cw



Bugatti Type-69 build page http://www.cyclekartdesign.com/

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smcameron Stephen Cameron
Santa Clara, CA, USA   USA
In reply to # 495 by SevenTurbanBourban We have been using 5/8 axles. I dont know why ppl use the 3/4 axles but so be it. The actual ID of the 'hole' left when the CT90 press-fit bearings are removed is <<<<<< 32mm >>>>> not 37.
Huh?

I press fit 37mm OD bearings (Dayton 6904zz) into my CT90 wheels. If that hole was 32mm, there's no way a 37mm bearing would have fit. The CT90 wheels I got all came with 37mm OD, 12mm ID press fit bearings.

We are talking 2 different kinds of wheels if yours took 32mm OD bearings.

The question is, which one of us has the weird wheels?

I got my bearings on May 18, 2009
http://scaryreasoner.wordpress.com/2009/05/19/cyclekart-progress-may-18-2009/
and in all the time since then nobody except you has mentioned to me anything about any 32mm OD bearings in Honda CT90 wheels.

-- steve



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2012-11-28 07:09 PM by smcameron.

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SevenTurbanBourban Avatar
SevenTurbanBourban Christobal Welchissimo
Auburn Hills, MI, USA   USA
1934 CycleKart Custom "Type-69"
1938 CycleKart Race Car "Rotten Tuna"
Hi Stephen, i dont doubt you press fit 37mm into the Ct90 hubs, but just for clarity what bearing number "call sign" did you buy? Our Detroit team is almost exclusively using '1623-2RS' or '6904-2RS' (non ceramic) for the front axle bearings....Are you speaking of the rear wheels?

cw



Bugatti Type-69 build page http://www.cyclekartdesign.com/

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smcameron Stephen Cameron
Santa Clara, CA, USA   USA
Dayton 6904zz. These right here:

http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/6904ZZ-1?gclid=CNj9zaf_8rMCFYVFMgodFTQAMQ

I think there's some confusion on my part.

I used four front wheels -- that is, I used two front wheels of the ct-90 motorcycle as the rear wheels of my cyclekart. Maybe you're saying the rear wheels of the motorcycle have a different bearing size than the front wheels of the motorcycle? I could believe that, since I never did anything with any of the ct-90 rear wheels.

-- steve



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-11-28 07:15 PM by smcameron.

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SevenTurbanBourban Avatar
SevenTurbanBourban Christobal Welchissimo
Auburn Hills, MI, USA   USA
1934 CycleKart Custom "Type-69"
1938 CycleKart Race Car "Rotten Tuna"
OK, so it sounds like you are talking about rear axle bearings with a 3/4 soft axle, not a 1" hardened keyway axle. I'm speaking of front axles specifically. I dont know too many ppl that are using 3/4 front axles with rear CT90 wheels, but so be it. Is this true?

cw



Bugatti Type-69 build page http://www.cyclekartdesign.com/

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smcameron Stephen Cameron
Santa Clara, CA, USA   USA
Hmm. I only used the Dayton 6904zz bearings in the cyclekart-front wheels, on 3/4th inch spindles (shimmed up to fit the 20mm inner diameter of the bearings)

On the cyclekart-rear wheels, I used *no* bearings. 1 inch diameter solid axle with keyway, necked down to 3/4 th inch at the ends, mounted ATV hubs to the honda wheels, and the ATV hubs are made to fit the 3/4th inch axle. On my kart, the bearings for the rear end are not on the wheels, they are mounted in the frame, and the axle slides into them (they have a 1 inch inner diameter, outer is kind of spherically shaped and fits into a kind of cage like flange that lets them turn like a kind of gimbal, so that they do not have to be mounted parallel (or even close to parallel) and you can still shove a solid axle through a pair of them.

Like this:
http://scaryreasoner.wordpress.com/2009/05/18/may-17-2009-cyclekart-progress-rear-axle-bearings/

(Actually, one of my cyclekart rear wheels *does* have a 6904zz bearing in it, but the inner surface of that bearing doesn't contact anything. I had thought I would use that wheel as a front wheel, and so had put a bearing in, but later decided to use it as a rear wheel, and was too lazy to take the bearing out, and just left it in since it didn't get in the way anyway.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-11-28 07:28 PM by smcameron.

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